The Question for athiest, Why do atheists believe in atheism? Nothing creating nothing is confusing for me was posted to the Quora site and led to the following discussion.
Nev Anderson commented
That you do not understand Atheism or even what it means,
yet have never bothered to even look it up in a dictionary,
indicates an abject lack of interest.
Atheism is a word that relates a Single State: Non Belief in gods.
It is not a belief in nothing, that is asinine and untenable,
a moments thought would have revealed that fact.
Nothing creating nothing happens all the time
ALL day today the empty space around me has created absolutely nothing.
I, Ken Ammi, replied
As for “look it up in a dictionary,” looking it up in “a,” singular, dictionary seems to be what you have done since you miss the various definitions, and usages, and denominations/sects of Atheism: https://truefreethinker.com/atheisms-sects
Thus, there are Atheists who demand that Atheism is and means a positive affirmation of God’s non-existence.
So if “Nothing creating nothing happens all the time” in the sense of “the empty space around me has created absolutely nothing” whence came the universe?
Nev Anderson
People generally look it up in a dictionary
rather than a dozen.
There are myriads of theists pretending to be Atheists who do that.
A few exchanges and the facade crumbles, theists do NOT comprehend Atheism.
Petty, petty semantics
as a petty, petty personal insult
reveals who you are.
We cannot see where the energy and matter that forms the universe came from.
Like the magician’s rabbit,
it does NOT MEAN from magic land.
Only the ignorant assign causality to imaginary phantasms.
Ken Ammi
Good point and by generally looking it up in a, singular, dictionary rather than a dozen they give one single resource way too much authority.
I complied various definitions and most affirm that “Atheism” also means the positive affirmation of God’s non-existence: “Atheism”: what does it mean? – truefreethinker.com
Can you name one theist pretending to be Atheist?
I thank God that I can’t even imagine how you misinterpret elucidating semantic facts as a “personal insult” which you further misinterpret as that it “reveals who” I am. That actually sounds like you may want to focus on being emotive rather than ironing out facts.
Now, you say “theists do NOT comprehend Atheism…magician’s rabbit…magic land…the ignorant…imaginary phantasms” but you don’t say what’d be wrong with accidentally existing apes doing and believing that within an existence wherein there’s no universal imperative for accidentally existing apes to not do and believe those things.
But I agree that “energy and matter that forms the universe” didn’t come from “imaginary phantasms.” They came from God.
The most up to date cosmology informs us that the universe is a time, space, matter continuum.
Gen 1:1 stated “In the beginning [time], God created the heavens [space] and the earth [matter].” How did ignorant Bronze Age goat herders know the most up to date cosmology?
Nev Anderson
The Oxford English Dictionary is THE Premier source of English Language Definitions. Rather than the profusion of purveyors of mangled language such as is prevalent in America, THE most fanatically religious nation on Earth.
Anyone or anything that labels itself as a “True Free Thinker” (or similar) empirically is nothing of the sort. What they inevitably reveal is that all they seek is confirmation for some presuppositional position.
An actual Free Thinker does not consider there to be need to advertise. Only the charlatan does.
Your god is an imaginary phantasm.
That is why you are unable to provide even a sliver of evidence for its existence.
Why every single claim made for it,
when investigated
is found to be completely fallacious.
Then there are the myriad asinine assertions attributed directly to it by your book of superstitions, lies and fallacies.
Such as:
the Earth is flat,
motionless,
set on pillars,
orbited by the sun,
under a star speckled dome,
that keeps out the waters of space,
whilst letting some in through windows,
as rain
Bronze age ignorance.
Ken Ammi
So, if I may recap your reply: you are so utterly and literally incapable of dealing with the issues that you launched a goal-post moving personal attack based on hidden assumption an peppered with mere assertions whilst being emotively childish: Atheism tactic 101.
That my “god is an imaginary phantasm” is a positive affirmation you must prove.
If you imply demanding evidence, then step one is for you to justify your demand—which should not be a big deal since you imply holding to the one true worldview.
We can also get around to your jumps to conclusions about your mistaken view of biblical cosmology.
Nev Anderson
No you may NOT.
For what you are doing is
Asserting YOUR words in place of mine.
This so as to
assert insult and accusation
that are unrelated to reality.
Thanks for confirming the religious stereotype.
Ken Ammi
I asked two questions in my previous reply, “Can you name one theist pretending to be Atheist?” and “How did ignorant Bronze Age goat herders know the most up to date cosmology?” so I’m unsure to what “No you may NOT.”
So as to not confirm the Atheist stereotype, please deal with the issues rather than launching personal attacks.
Nev Anderson
Do you think I keep lists?
It is simple EVERY TIME an “Atheist” states something that aligns with the religious STRAWMAN version of Atheism, THAT is a theist pretending.
This is NOT even close to cosmology,
it is merely ignorance and wild guesses:
the Earth is flat,
motionless,
set on pillars,
orbited by the sun,
under a star speckled dome,
that keeps out the waters of space,
whilst letting some in through windows,
as rain
There is no personal attack.
Here you are inserting YOUR WORDS as mine:
… and me calling you on it.
There IS an observation of your behaviour,
presented in THIS thread.
Where YOU assert YOUR baseless assertions
about something you not only do NOT know about,
but also
Could NEVER know about.
So,
once again the theist makes fallacious accusations
In line with a stereotype so well worn that your confirmation wasn’t required.
Ken Ammi
Well, I’m unsure how you can read the minds of Atheists but hey, I’ve heard people assert odder stuff.
I’m unsure how you can say that the universe being a time, space, matter continuum is “NOT even close to cosmology” and “merely ignorance and wild guesses” when it was correctly identified as such so many millennia ago.
“There is no personal attack”? How about “a petty, petty personal insult reveals who you are…ignorant…charlatan…asinine,” etc. so those (et al.) qualify as “based on hidden assumption an peppered with mere assertions whilst being emotively childish.”
Thus, I did no inserting of anything anywhere but if I did, you lack any premise upon which to call me on it—except by appealing to your impotent subjective personal preference du jour (based on hidden assumptions).
You seem to be projecting when, based on subjective personal preferences du jour, you complain about “YOU assert YOUR baseless assertions.”
Nev Anderson
T’rolling
The assertion of things NOT SAID
to fit your need.
Be gone.
Ken Ammi
I can understand why you are desperate to run away since this discussion has evidenced that you’re incapable of defending your worldview. Yet, that’s because your worldview has failed you. And that’s because your worldview is such a failure that it actually fails before it even begins.
Nev Anderson
Atheism isn’t a world view.
That is an indication of the nonsense you assert
and you will never change.
You merely waste my time.
Ken Ammi
That is an indication of the nonsense you assert
and you will never change.
You merely waste my time.
See how easy it is to ignore issues that are inconvenient and just run away? Atheist tactic 101.
Nev Anderson
Theists persistently level the worst of their own behaviour as accusations against others.
It is YOU who is asserting the existence of a non evident, non manifesting, invisible, magical phantasm.
THAT requires determined assertion of lies and fallacy.
The Non Belief in that rubbish requires only the recognition of rationality and reality
Ken Ammi
I’m not interested in engaging you on what “Theists,” the overwhelming majority of all humans who have ever existed, “persistently level” since you’re painting with a broad brush broom.
But what, on your worldview, is wrong with theists persistently leveling the worst of their own behaviour as accusations against others?
Likewise, what’s wrong with “asserting the existence of a non evident, non manifesting, invisible, magical phantasm”?
What’s wrong with “assertion of lies and fallacy”?
You seem to imply you have to rationalize yourself to rationality and then appeal to accidental reality.
Nev Anderson
YOU continue to assert your words as mine,
I will leave you with your dishonesty.
Ken Ammi
Now you attempt to distract by claiming I’m dishonest as an excuse to run away but what, on your worldview is wrong with dishonesty and how do you know that I’m being dishonest?
Well, that ended the discussion.
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