Someone chimed in to write this to me:
Ken Ammi just a thought to add… when hava gives birth to Cain and says she has gotten a man from the lord.. the Hebrew here for Lord is the Tetragrammaton. I wonder if Zen sees that as an issue.. as it would mean making a case that the Tetragrammaton can be used to represent the most high or.. hasatan [the Satan] or various angels. [ellipses in original]
Zen Garcia replied thusly:
As posted above: Actually the original passage references that she got a man child from the angel of the Lord or that the child itself is an angel of the Lord. And then she added from her husband another child Abel.
IV. And Adam knew Hava his wife, who had desired the Angel; and she conceived, and bare Kain; and she said, I have acquired a man, the Angel of the Lord. And she added to bear from her husband Adam his twin, even Habel. – Targum
And Adam knew his wife Eve, who was pregnant by Sammael [Satan], and she conceived and bare Cain, and he was like the heavenly beings, and not like earthly beings, and she said, I have gotten a man from the angel of the Lord.” – Eisenmenger, 1748, p. 198
Note that he cannot even keep his own story straight. He wrote that “As posted above:…she got a man child from the angel of the Lord or that the child itself is an angel of the Lord” yet, the text he quoted specifically stated the nonsensical paraphrase that Eve “had desired the Angel…I have acquired a man, the Angel of the Lord.”
Note that the citations “Targum” and Eisenmenger” are genetic enough to be useless. Simply referring to Targum as a citation to a specific quotation would be like citing “Bible” to a quote which would lead to the question, “Bible? In which of the 66 books thereof?” Likewise, there are many Targumim and generic citations to the “Targum” do not tell us which one. If asked, and I have dealt with this issue with Zen, he will offer generic descriptions of what Targumim are but this does not tell the unaware of un-skeptical reader that while the Targumim began to be produced just before the time of Jesus, Zen Garcia relies virtually exclusively on a very, very late dated one that is peppered with Rabbinic folklore. Zen tends to avoid ancient Hebrew, Greek, Syriac, and other manuscripts because they do not contains the much, much later accretions upon which he relies for the serpent seed theory.
At the self-publishing Lulu site where Zen sells his edition (for an outrageous $45.00) he, for some reason, offers three different descriptions of the Targumim in the three different places where his book is listed.
One is cited as being from “Wikipedia” which notes that Pseudo-Jonathan “is more than a mere translation. It includes much Aggadic material [narrative, parables, maxims, anecdotes, etc.] collected from various sources as late as the Midrash Rabbah [circa 425 AD] as well as earlier material from the Talmud [of which there are two which were compiled 500-600 AD]. So it is a combination of a commentary and a translation” (I added the bracketed statement so that the information would actually be informative and helpful). Another description also notes that the Targumim contain “additional commentary and paraphrase.”
Below, we will consider that which he above referred to simply as “Targum.” Eisenmenger refers to Johann Andreas Eisenmenger (1654-1704 AD) who was a German Orientalist.
Interestingly, in his book Lucifer – Father of Cain Zen provided the very same quotations as above but therein he cited them as “Palestinian Targum” and “Aramaic Targum, Targum of Jonathan.” In that book Zen Garcia seems to provide us with a Freudian slip (or, a Fraud-ian slip actually) in noting “The Targum of Jonathan add even greater detail to this supposition…” indeed, the Targum of Jonathan adds (something that ought not be done to the Bible) folklore not found in any earlier manuscripts of any language and his theory is a mere supposition.
Next, I provided details about just what Zen is quoting here as he never seems to provide detailed citations to it:
Zen, you keep referring to “the original passage” but you are not telling these dear unsuspecting people to what you are referring as being “the original passage”: please tell then what text you are quoting. You and I both known that you are quoting the Aramaic from the Palestinian Targum Pseudo-Jonathan which dates to the sixth century AD which is circa 1,500 to 2,000 years after the Book of Genesis was written (depending on when one dates Genesis).
Then, to the other person’s comment, I replied:
[Name withheld], you are quite right that Hava refers to having gotten a man from the Tetragrammaton and NOT from the Angel of the Lord. I would say that Zen SHOULD see it as an issue as he is teaching things that are contradicting the Bible. But he does not see that as an issue because he is basing his views on not on the Greek Septuagint/LXX, nor on any Hebrew manuscripts whatsoever but on the Aramaic from the Palestinian Targum Pseudo-Jonathan which dates to the sixth century AD which is circa 1,500 to 2,000 years after the Book of Genesis was written (depending on when one dates Genesis). He keeps referring to “the original passage” but does not tell people that he is quoting this very, very, very late dated Targum which is not only a translation but a paraphrase which includes Rabbinic folkloric interpretations.
FYI: The repetitiveness of my info about the Targum is due to not knowing if a commentator is reading all comments or only those made them.
This person replied thusly to me:
Thank you bro. Finally some sense in these comments. These speculators are in it for fame and money and are ignoring the great danger of these theories. If genetics is the source of evil, then we just have to find and exterminate all tainted people. Another Final Solution ? !! Pure B.S. These topics are fascinating but we cannot throw out the essence of the Bible’s message or basic rational.
I will check out the articles.
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