The question posted to the Quora site was Are the fallen angels in 2 Peter 2:4 that are in chains of darkness the Watchers or Nephilim, and how do they compare to Satan and his angels that fell? to which a certain Sam Dragut replied
the word Watchers is interchangeable with the word messengers & angels but not Nephilim
the main reason for this is because the angels main function on earth is to watch & witness, & record the goings on in this earth. they don’t get involved unless ordered to
however once a watcher leaves his job working for god they no longer classify as a watcher
The Nephilim are not angels. they are the children of a mixed union between a human and other sons of god who moved to earth . however despite the false claims of the book of Enoch these are not angels but humanoids very similar to us from other planets who sided with Satan in his rebellion & were ousted from their own home and moved here to make earth their new home. this is why we have so much evidence of extra terrestrial activity & advanced technology because some of these came from advanced technology planets. Some used their knowledge for selfish purposes & did much evil. this is the purpose of the flood. it’s a reset of earth. humans are now creating similar technology.We’re no different. we’re using it to create weapons to destroy each other instead of helping each other. we are returning to the state of the earth before the flood. Jesus coming is another reset.
I, Ken Ammi, replied
Actually, “angels main function on earth is to” deliver messages: that’s the literal meaning of their job title, Malakim.
Nephilim were humanoids as in half-Angel and half-human. The original, traditional, and majority view among the earliest Jewish and Christians commentators, starting in BC days, was the “Angel view” as I proved in my book, “On the Genesis 6 Affair’s Sons of God: Angels or Not?: A Survey of Early Jewish and Christian Commentaries Including Notes on Giants and the Nephilim.”
I’m unaware of any “other planets who sided with Satan…”
Sam Dragut
What was the last time you received a message from god using an angel?
there are billions of angels on earth. that’s a lot of messages. what was the last time you met anyone who saw an angel delivering a message? your “literal” meaning is so far removed from reality it would make me laugh if it wasn’t sad.
your information comes from mythology & fantasy. Messengers doesn’t mean what you think it does. they deliver the will of god, they are not a post office. your understanding is very basic. as to Nephilim being half-Angel and half-human that is as far from humanoids as it gets. you try to cross mosquito with human DNA. i can guarantee it won’t be a humanoid . you can’t cross the wind with flesh except in fantasy.
Ken Ammi
It would be fairly tricky to know when I would have received a message from God via an Angel since, by definition, it’s be tricky to know who is an Angel, “some have entertained angels unawares” (Hebrews 13:2).
As for, “‘literal’ meaning” that’s not mine, it’s been the standard understanding for millennia: please see my books, “What Does the Bible Say About Angels? A Styled Angelology” and “Bible Encyclopedias and Dictionaries on Angels, Demons, Nephilim, and Giants: From 1851 to 2010” and “The Paranormal in Early Jewish and Christian Commentaries: Over a Millennia’s Worth of Comments on Angels, Cherubim, Seraphim, Satan, the Devil, Demons, the Serpent and the Dragon” [all found here]
Oddly, I noted, “deliver messages: that’s the literal meaning of their job title, Malakim” and you seem to agree but just feel like arguing, for some reason, so you affirm that but opt for a synonym, “deliver the will of god” whatever that means.
I’m unsure how, “half-Angel and half-human” wouldn’t be “humanoids” (feel free to throw that word out if you want) since both of their parents look just like humans. I’ve no idea what you’re going on about “mosquito with human DNA.”
Sam Dragut
God is not ambiguous like Satan. if god sends you a message using an angel that angel will identify who he is, who sent him & why. He will not make you guess. When God has a message for you i promise you that you will know it comes from God. deception is not his style.
i’m saying that you can’t mix fire with timber & expect another tree to grow except in fantasy.humans share approximately 98% of their DNA with pigs, and house cats share about 95.6% of their DNA with tigers, but you can’t have sex with a pig & expect children. Angels are made of fire & energy. we’re not DNA compatible by gods standards especially given what their creator said. Angels are not given reproductive or creation ability. this is pure human invention.
the bible description of angels as messenger or servants Hebrews 1:14 & protect the righteous (Matthew 4:6, Luke 4:11). They dwell in the heavens (Matthew 28:2, John 1:51), act as God’s warriors (Matthew 26:53) and worship God (Luke 2:13). In the parable of the Rich man and Lazarus, angels behave as psychopomps.
it is presumptuous to choose one & assume this is their job. it is not presumptuous to assume they are created to serve their creator in whatever task they are given. i can tell you that on this earth their main function is as observers & record keeping not delivering messages.
The views of early Jewish and Christian commentaries spanning from 250 BC to the 5th century AD regarding the “sons of God” of Genesis 6 that includes notes on giants & the Nephilim. From Adam to Christ, is 3974 years, six months, & 10 days;. these commentaries are at best a guess based on cultural beliefs at the time. I find it amazing how humans are so ignorant & prefer to believe human lies rather than the creators own words. Matthew 22:30 For in the resurrection neither do men marry nor are women given in marriage, but they are like angels in heaven [who do not marry nor produce children]. AMPC.
Ken Ammi
FYI: when you urge me to ignore God’s word for your say so, it’s not a difficult choice.
I’m unaware of any indication that “Angels are made of fire & energy.”
You also merely assert, “we’re not DNA compatible…Angels are not given reproductive or creation ability” but Angels are always described as looking like human males, we were created “a little lower” than them, and we can reproduce with them so, by definition, we’re of the same basic “kind.”
I’m unsure to what you’re referring by “what their creator said.”
I’m unsure why you assert “it is presumptuous to choose one & assume this is their job” after I noted, “‘angels main function on earth is to’ deliver messages”: there’s a categorical difference between “one” and “main.”
You’re merely asserting “these commentaries are at best a guess based on cultural beliefs at the time.”
You’re also merely asserting they are, “human lies.”
You seem to not have paid close enough attention to Matthew 22:30 since Jesus’ words, His emphasis, His qualifying term, His point was about, “angels in heaven” ergo, the loyal ones, which is why those who did marry are considered sinners, having, “left their first estate,” as Jude put it.
Friend, just making up stuff is no way to rightly divide God’s word.
Sam Dragut
you add up 2 plus 2 and come up with 13. its not even worth replying. your mind is closed to understanding the truth. your understanding is so warped that if a dead person came from the grave to correct you i think you’d prefer to believe the lies you’ve been taught. do your research. angels are not made of the same DNA material & Matthew 22:30 is not talking about the place of residence but about sex & reproduction. you remind me of someone who was so warped they twisted the bible to try to prove homosexuality is biblical. do you even know what Jude means by “first estate”? good luck
Ken Ammi
I see that your man-made tradition has failed you so terribly that you’re going to pull a tactic like the Atheists do and run away from issues that are devastating to it with a mere, “its not even worth replying.”
As for, “do your research” well, I’ve familiarized myself with over two millennia worth of relevant data so, what am I missing? For example, I wrote the following books:
“What Does the Bible Say About Angels? A Styled Angelology.”
“On the Genesis 6 Affair’s Sons of God: Angels or Not?: A Survey of Early Jewish and Christian Commentaries Including Notes on Giants and the Nephilim.”
“The Paranormal in Early Jewish and Christian Commentaries: Over a Millennia’s Worth of Comments on Angels, Cherubim, Seraphim, Satan, the Devil, Demons, the Serpent and the Dragon.”
You say, “angels are not made of the same DNA material” but it’s biblically demonstrable that Angels are always described as looking like human males, we were created “a little lower” than them, and we can reproduce with them so, by definition, we’re of the same basic “kind.” But see, I already told you that but you find it inconvenient to you merely repeat yourself rather than arguing against facts.
As for, Matthew 22:30 Jesus’ words, His emphasis, His qualifying term, His point was about, “angels in heaven” ergo, the loyal ones, which is why those who did marry are considered sinners. But see, I already told you that but you find it inconvenient to you merely repeat yourself rather than arguing against facts.
And I’m not interested in your styled gnostic parting shot.
When your modus operandi it what it is it just proves that your man-made tradition fails you which is why you have to manipulate and ignore God’s word and merely double, triple, quadruple (or whatever number you’re on) assertions.
That brought the discussion to and end as no more replies were forthcoming.
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